Which Pitcher...

by Stros Bro on Nov 26, 2007 8:26 PM CST in News Comment 20 comments

on the Astros struck out the most batters last season?

Okay, I know this is really easy to find out, but the answer could surprise you. Maybe I didn't keep as good of a watch on the pitching stats at the end of the season last year, but when I was browsing through the stats today(was really bored sorry...), I noticed that this pitcher led the team in strike outs. Surprised I was.

Read more for the answer...

That pitcher was Wandy Rodriguez... shocked? Yea I was. Wandy actually had a decent year last year overall. Wandy had 158 strike outs compared to Roy O's 154. We all know that Roy isn't a strike out pitcher... he pitches to contact and tries to keep his pitch count down and if he really tried, could probably increase his strike out numbers. But I'm still surprised it was Wandy.

Sorry if I just wasted your time by telling you information that you already knew, but it surprised me, so I thought it might surprise some of you as well.

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The last time our Ace Roy O led

the team in Strikeouts was ..... 2002!

He was second to Pettite Last year, second to Clemens in '05 and '04 (one less than Clemens in '05), and third in the injury-plagued '03 year.

This is exactly why I believe that Strikeouts are a totally overrated stat. They are great to project a 21 year old's future, but not for actual established pitchers. Oswalt is probably, after Santana, the most dominant pitcher of the past 5 years, and the winningest pitcher this CENTURY, yet he is not a strikeout guy. That diminishes nothing from his career.

Long Live Roy-O.

Kill the Curse of Enron Field

by juicebox44 on Nov 26, 2007 9:07 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Oswalt is the exception to the rule

You can go a million ways with this.

But here is the way to evaluate a pitcher to ME. Off the top of my head. In importance.

WHIP
K/9
K/BB
GB/FB
ERA
HR/9

And each case is separate. Each guy will have strengths and weaknesses with those 6 categories. So being great at one won't mean being lousy at another means something or....... blah.

That is just my feeling. But for a guy to have as low a K/9 as Roy and produce every year is the rule breaker.

Make the world a better place. Punch Tim Purpura in the face.

by Shamus on Nov 26, 2007 9:43 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Roy O's K rate...

dropped to his career low last seaason. But at the same time, his groundball rate was the highest of his career (53%). I feel that the the damaging impact of the dip in his strike out rate may have been mitigated by the rise in his groundball rate. Oswalt had the misfortune of emphasizing his "pitch to contact" philosophy in the same year that the Astros played with one of their worst fielding teams.

by clack on Nov 26, 2007 9:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Yea..

but in those other years, we actually had other decent starting pitchers... last year we had... Roy and then a bunch of nothing...

Go 'Stros!

by Stros Bro on Nov 26, 2007 11:34 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Maybe this will surprise you then:

Wandy was 10th in the NL in strike outs per 9 innings last season.

http://www.hardballtimes.com/thtstats/main/index.php?view=pitching&league_filter[0]=2&orderBy=kPerG&direction=DESC&page=1

by clack on Nov 26, 2007 9:09 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

and

they signed Brocail which I could care less about.

Make the world a better place. Punch Tim Purpura in the face.

by Shamus on Nov 26, 2007 9:44 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Given's Wade's reputation...

for signing older relief pitchers, I'm sure this will be the fodder for much humor on certain baseball blogs. I am naturally skeptical of expecting a lot from a 40 year old relief pitcher. But I don't think this is that bad a signing (assuming Brocail isn't costing a lot). Brocail was pretty good last year for the Padres (yeah, it was in a pitcher's park). I doubt that he will be that good next season, but I would think there is a good chance that he will provide league average relief work out of the pen. Assuming that Wade is still shopping for a closer, all of the additions to the bullpen make me wonder what the Astros plan to do with incumbent middle relievers (like Borkowski).

by clack on Nov 26, 2007 11:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Just noticed...

Brocail is a Type B free agent, meaning the Astros will give up their 2d round pick. It may not mean much if the Astros make any more signings of Elias ranked players, since that is the only pick they can give up.

by clack on Nov 27, 2007 8:35 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

No

we only LOSE a pick if we sign a type A free agent. A type B only means a sandwich pick for the team that loses him, if I'm not mistaken.

by littlevisigoth on Nov 27, 2007 10:25 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Upon further review...

you may be right.

by clack on Nov 27, 2007 11:06 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Doesn't look like a horrible signing

although I'm not very familiar with Brocail. I'm just looking at his numbers. Last year was his best year since missing a few seasons to surgeries, but his career numbers are pretty solid and if he can resemble at all his numbers from last year, he'd be a solid 6th or 7th inning guy. His walk numbers are pretty low, as well as his HR numbers. If we ARE able to significantly improve our defense, he should be able to find some success in Houston. His GB ratio has been about 1.00 the last couple of years though.

by littlevisigoth on Nov 27, 2007 10:37 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Hmm

We trade Lane and Ensberg to the Padres, and then sign BLum and Brocail from San Diego.

by jonthefon on Nov 26, 2007 10:16 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Would you have felt better if..

We traded Lane and Ensberg for Blum and Brocail? =)

Go 'Stros!

by Stros Bro on Nov 26, 2007 11:33 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Hardly.

Both of them aren't exactly groundbreaking material, since I still had slim hopes of Outsberg/Moberg and Lane of regaining some sort of form.

by jonthefon on Nov 27, 2007 2:49 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Not surprised

I was always noticing last season when Wandy would pitch that it would be like the 5th or 6th inning and he'd have 8 strikeouts or so. How many 6+ K games did he have total, I wonder.

by exit53 on Nov 27, 2007 12:22 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

12

Games of 6 or more strike outs last season.

Roy had 11

Go 'Stros!

by Stros Bro on Nov 27, 2007 4:38 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Okay, Lemme

play the Devil's Advocate.

Wandy led the team in strikeouts in '07, and Roy Oz hasn't led the team in K's since '02.

Wandy also led the team in WHIP, and Roy O hasn't led starters in that category since '03.

And sabermetric types tell us wins are meaningless, while innings pitched seems like such a blunt tool.

So how do you prove what Astro fans know--that Oswalt's been the best pitcher in Houston for the last six years?

Cortisone shots: Not just for overpaid athletes anymore.

by rastronomicals on Nov 28, 2007 5:07 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

ERA

Go 'Stros!

by Stros Bro on Nov 28, 2007 6:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

The peripheral stuff...

like K rates, BB rates, BABIP, etc. aren't the stats to tell you who was the best pitcher. They are better at telling you whether a pitcher can repeat his performance or is likely to improve his performance in the future. ERA, Runs Allowed and WHIP are the stats to tell you who got the best results in any given year. They may tell you little about the pitcher's future peformance, because those results-oriented stats can vary with luck. I think Oswalt is among the rare breed, like Roy Halliday, who can consistently post a great ERA without striking out a lot of batters.

by clack on Nov 28, 2007 7:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Maybe Wandy IS the best pitcher now?

Lee, Pence, Scott in '08

by entropic soul on Nov 28, 2007 7:29 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

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