Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Login-facebook
Around SBN: Win or Lose, Boston Celtics' New Big 3 Era A Success

More Thoughts As Front Office Firings Sink In

Lots and lots and LOTs of media reaction so far this morning on the news that Wade and Smith are gone. Let's run down the highlights before getting to more thoughts:

 

 

That's a lot to react to, but I'll do my best after the jump...

Star-divide

The more and more that I hear about how Crane went about this, I'm more and more furious that the ownership transition took this long. Wade should have been fired back in September or October, giving Houston the chance to find a GM long before this point.

I know Crane got the $70 million for negotiating in the months between the July vote and the November confirmation. He probably was able to then use some of that savings to justify eating two years of Wade's contract. But, it still stinks. Selig ramrodded this whole AL move down the Houston franchise's throat and it cost him more than just money. It cost him time.

The list of GM candidates Steve Campbell gathered is fairly impressive. I am no more ready to say Andrew Friedman is likely to come back to Houston than I was when his name surfaced this summer. Hunsicker? Maybe. I still think it's most likely that the guy who will be in charge is one of the two Ranger executives. Crane has played up how much he likes that franchise and how they work. Both of those guys would move easily right now, could be set up as a GM easily with a step up and wouldn't cost a whole lot of money. If Crane so chose, he could even bring Hunsicker back as the President of Baseball Operations and install someone like Thad Levine as GM. 

The only way I see David Forst moving from Oakland is if he were offered the presidency. I don't know that even that will be enough to move him, given the state of the franchise. 

I really wonder why Crane didn't meet with Smith before he got the axe, especially when he did so with Ed Wade. To me, that is more a statement of how Crane viewed Smith's position within the organization. Also, don't automatically assume this means the Astros will do worse in arbitration hearings. The Rays have a pretty good track record there and they don't use Smith's consulting service. It's going to be harder to find someone competent to do it, but arbitration alone isn't enough to justify keeping Smith. Still a remarkable show of disrespect to Smith. I guess that's life in the Big City.

My favorite part of this decision? Justice's comment that Crane decided to fire Wade not because he was incompetent (like Tim Purpura), but to try and get someone who was above-average. That's what I want to see. Don't settle for good, go for the best. That's how you create a winning team again. Can Crane do it? I'm not sure, but all this certainly seems like a step in the right direction.

Comment 33 comments  |  0 recs  | 

Do you like this story?

Comments

Display:

If I were a GM candidate on Crane's list

I would demand a six to seven year contract at least. I agree with Olney that it’s going to take the better part of a decade to get the Astros back into the playoff mix, even with two Wild Cards. And that’s considering that the AL West looks like a ripe plum for the taking, beyond the Rangers.

The Astros need to commit to a GM with a solid rebuilding plan, and they need to stick to that plan. Start/Stopping every four or five years with new front office personnel isn’t going to get the job done. Overpay for the brains at the top, and give them the keys to the city. That’s the only way the Astros won’t turn into the Pirates or Royals from the ’90’s and ’00s.

by CRPerry13 on Nov 28, 2011 12:42 PM CST reply actions  

Agreed

You’re going to have to make a strong commitment to get a talented GM. It also says that you understand the task at hand. I truly think that Drayton always thought this thing was fixable in just a couple years. They pissed away the last decade in terms of player development and we are now paying the piper for the next ten.

by Raidas77 on Nov 28, 2011 2:05 PM CST up reply actions  

I like the Idea of Hinsicker as President and Levine as GM

That seems like a good recipe as you’re sorta getting the best (or almost the best) from bothe worlds. Hopefully why he fired Wade will prove to be true and obvious when we see who he picks up

by Its Gonna Happen on Nov 28, 2011 1:14 PM CST via mobile reply actions  

Actually

Think about the transition that the Astros have gone through under Wade. He started with I believe THE oldest roster in all of baseball and an almost talentless minor league system. He has transitioned us to a very youthful team and about half the payroll that he started with.

That sounds doable but when you think we’re a young team now and 4 years ago we didn’t have a young guy to speak of…that’s pretty impressive. Having said that, I think that there’s better out there and hope we get it.

by Its Gonna Happen on Nov 28, 2011 1:32 PM CST via mobile up reply actions  

while I agree, it’s easy getting young, it’s a whole different ballgame to get young and good. And I don’t think we’re anywhere close to that.

by AronV on Nov 28, 2011 2:00 PM CST up reply actions  

Very true

But none of the players we field today, minus Bogey (pitcher), were in the system when Wade came in. Now granted we just fielded the worst team in baseball, and didn’t have any significant injuries throughout the year, but we did trade away our two best players for the second consecutive year and some of these young guys have some really nice upside but were rushed too soon.

by Its Gonna Happen on Nov 28, 2011 2:26 PM CST via mobile up reply actions  

I think Altuve was a Purpura signing, but I’d have to double-check.

by CRPerry13 on Nov 28, 2011 2:51 PM CST up reply actions  

+1

I’d love to see Hunsicker and Levine in charge.

"Hakeem couldn't kick your ass cuz you were too
close kissin his!"- Sir Charles to Kenny Smith.

by bone31crusher on Nov 28, 2011 1:39 PM CST up reply actions  

1. Olney paints a fairly negative picture of the Astros’ ability to attract a good GM. I agree that it will be tough to attract an existing GM, given the Astros’ situation. But I think the Astros can be a very attractive job for a talented and confident young assistant GM. The expectations for a quick turnaround are low, which means it’s not hard to exceed expectations. (Think about how quickly the perceptions of a very young Alex Anthropolous moved from low expectations to phenom GM.) I think the key is how much authority is given the new GM, e.g., ability to hire and fire front office people, minimal owner interference in player transactions, etc. A young GM who is confident in his abilities to build the team would view a clean slate as an ideal challenge to show what he can do.

2. The evergreen contract renewal provision in Wade’s contract raises a lot of questions. Were Postolos and Crane aware that the provision would kick in? (Crane’s people would have seen all of the team’s contracts, but who knows if they were looking for this.) If they were aware of it, why didn’t they ask McLane to cancel the automatic extension of Wade’s contract for 2013? And if they did ask, would McLane have done it?

by clack on Nov 28, 2011 3:18 PM CST reply actions  

I imagine that quality of the system is pretty low on the list for things GMs look for when moving teams, at least the type of GMs we would actually want. Quality of the owner has to be a lot higher. A guy who is willing to trust his people and give them the tools they need has to be a lot more attractive than some idiot who thinks any team is a veteran or two away from contention.

by seanbergmanrules on Nov 28, 2011 9:21 PM CST up reply actions  

Good point. Quality of the system is highly subjective anyway. I think Olney is overly pessimistic. I don’t see why the Astros job isn’t better than half the jobs out there.

by jmike on Nov 29, 2011 8:28 PM CST up reply actions  

I need to be educated

What are the respective roles of President of Baseball Operations and General Manager?

Why does a team need both (especially since there is a team president, and an active owner))?

I’m thinking if Astros hire a great GM I could be president of Baseball Operations. Wheree do I sign? Let’s do lunch.)

Astros fan for life

by Joe in Birmingham on Nov 28, 2011 5:00 PM CST reply actions  

Well, think of the combo of Tal Smith and Ed Wade. I suppose the President gets to have more deep thoughts. The GM gets to do more of the detail work.

I think it can be a way of increasing the amount of talent in your front office. Theo Epstein was hired as President of Baseball Operations for the Cubs. He then turned around and hired the GM and Asst. GM of the Padres as Exec. VP-GM and Senior VP for Player Development.

by clack on Nov 28, 2011 5:18 PM CST up reply actions  

Astros have recieved permission to interview Andrew Friedman

Reports Richard Justice of the Houston Chronicle.

Now this is exciting!!! Not only is Jim Crane determined to tear down the yellow colored, floral wallpaper covered, moldy, and disgusting walls of yesteryear, but it appears he wants to build a much stronger foundation than before in order to create a perpetually winning franchise in the future.

It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt.

by BustaPozee on Nov 28, 2011 7:52 PM CST reply actions  

Wow!!

Thats amazing, just thinking of the possibility of Friedman gets me excited for the Astros future.

It would also be a great way for Crane to build some goodwill with Astros fans

by maroonedTexan on Nov 28, 2011 8:00 PM CST up reply actions  

I had the exact same reaction

Just the possibility of Friedman shows me the new ownership knows what they are doing. Patience will be tough, but decisions like this will make it easier.

by HTown4Eva on Nov 28, 2011 9:26 PM CST up reply actions  

I would lose it if we somehow managed to land Friedman. Imagine what the guy could do with an actual major league payroll?

The bird is struggling out of the egg. The egg is the world. Whoever wants to be born, must first destroy a world.

by Stupendous Man on Nov 28, 2011 8:33 PM CST via mobile up reply actions  

I'm still not getting my hopes up.

Friedman, according to many sources, is happy in Tampa Bay. Maybe throwing a ton of money at him will change his mind. I hope Crane ends up doing that.

"Hakeem couldn't kick your ass cuz you were too
close kissin his!"- Sir Charles to Kenny Smith.

by bone31crusher on Nov 28, 2011 8:52 PM CST up reply actions  

I can't imagine Mills staying after the new GM comes in.

New ownership/president/general manager duo makes me think between them one or more of them are going to want “their guy” as manager. So it wouldn’t be surprising to see Mills gone sometime soon.

The bird is struggling out of the egg. The egg is the world. Whoever wants to be born, must first destroy a world.

by Stupendous Man on Nov 29, 2011 12:38 AM CST via mobile up reply actions  

I think Mills gets one more year.

by jmike on Nov 29, 2011 8:29 PM CST up reply actions  

It's not like we need a new manager

Our team is bad. Let him manage to the end of his contract and THEN get a new manager when we have a good team.

It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt.

by BustaPozee on Nov 30, 2011 6:18 AM CST up reply actions  

If I was Jim Crane

and put that much money into a team, I would fire everyone as well.

It’s his money.

It’s his team.

It’s got to be his guys.

Living in Atlanta, the Falcons came in and did the right thing (yes, it’s a different sport, but it applies here). Find someone to run it the way you want it and put them in place on day 1.

Put the pieces in place that you want and cut a lot of salary.

While I’m more of a high school kid drafter, in this case, I would be going for college hitters ala the Washington Nationals and making sure that I had the right minor league coaches and managers in place to teach them.

by Seadogs on Nov 28, 2011 10:55 PM CST reply actions  

Ideal Situation

2011- Astros hire Andrew Friedman as GM
2012- Joe Maddens contract runs out
            Astros hire Joe Madden as manager

Unlikely but i can dream.

by Uncle Chris on Nov 28, 2011 11:15 PM CST reply actions  

Necessary.....

……I’m not a Wade or Mills " hater" but wholesale changes were needed to counter the culture of losing that pervades the organization…..

by jkaflagg on Nov 29, 2011 12:31 AM CST via iPhone app reply actions  

I LOVE (wish I could put a heart symbol here)

That Crane basically pissed on Tal Smith. Hes been an untouchable boonon this franchise for yeeeeears, and his arb. business is a direct conflict of interest, and hes old – and he makes old uninformed decisions (Kvasinaka to name one) – and I dont like him – and he has shitty hair, and I’m so glad that old fart is gone!!!!

The new era is beginning.

by YohannDookeyblue on Nov 29, 2011 12:59 AM CST reply actions  

crane, personnel, title contention

i think we could contend in 2012…not likely, but we could.HOW…..field a young team..with a more fixed lineup than in 2011…see what happens.. if we start doing ok…make a few adjustments…see what happens.. i do not agree with 4-7 yrs…nonsense…wade has pieces in place.. i would trade wandy and myers if possible and if we get a bunch in return… we got some of the best prospects from other teams…these are still in AA and AAA…all mills did last yr was play a bunch of different prospects… i was not impressed with his managing..but he was trying out players..that was his main goal…. crane has no money … couldnt even pay to buy the team..that is good in a way, cause he is forced to follow rebuilding plan of growing from within and cheaply….BUT WE HAVE A GROUP OF VERY GOOD YOUNG PLAYERS…SIC EM!! MIKE H

by Mike HJALM on Nov 29, 2011 12:42 PM CST reply actions  

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

Welcome to the Crawfishboxes, the SBNation blog for the Houston Astros.

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recommended FanPosts

Chimp_small
The Importance of George Springer

Recent FanPosts

Small
Oswalt in 2012
Small
Heck and Co. - Your time is up.
Small
Santana and a bold new top 10, etc..
Astros_retro_logo1_small
Lance Berkman with possible torn ACL...
Astros_retro_logo1_small
Quasi update on Lucas Giolito for draft
100_1519_small
Good News
Small
Thinking about where the top 2012 draftees will be ranked for 2013
Astros_small
Most valuable building blocks
Nsapcs13_large_small
Minor League Open Thread

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >

TCB Tweets!

    

Current Series

Astros lead the series 1-0

Fri 05/25 WP: Lucas Harrell (4 - 3)
SV: Brett Myers
LP: Clayton Kershaw (4 - 2)
3 - 1 win

Houston Astros
@ Los Angeles Dodgers

Saturday, May 26, 2012, 9:10 PM CDT
Dodger Stadium

Bud Norris vs Chad Billingsley

Mostly clear. Winds blowing out to right field at 5-15 m.p.h. Game time temperature around 65.

Complete Coverage >

Sun 05/27 3:10 PM CDT

NL Central Standings

W L PCT GB STRK
Cincinnati 25 20 .555 0 Lost 1
St. Louis 25 21 .543 0.5 Lost 2
Houston 22 23 .488 3 Won 4
Pittsburgh 21 24 .466 4 Won 1
Milwaukee 19 26 .422 6 Won 2
Chicago 15 30 .333 10 Lost 10

(updated 5.26.2012 at 6:14 PM CDT)

Yahoo_full_count

Managing Editors

Tcb_icon_small Timothy De Block

Old_school_dome_logo_small David Coleman

Editors

Nsapcs13_large_small clack

H_astros_small Subber10

Astrobritrs2_small AstroB

Small conroestro

Small CRPerry13