Michael Bourn : The Worst Leadoff Hitter in Baseball
by Stros Bro
on May 14, 2008 9:37 PM CDT
Stats don't lie... Why he is still hitting 1st is beyond me.
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That shows him at 20th...
....should be somewhere in the 30s, no? There have to be at least 32 leadoff hitters in the league, right?
by drsarc on May 14, 2008 10:25 PM CDT 0 recs
maybe it shows only qualified batters...
some teams may have changed their lead off men a lot, such that there aren’t any batters with enough plate appearances at lead off. just guessing.
by clack on
May 15, 2008 1:28 AM CDT
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No Bueno
Bourn has only one double? That’s pitiful. The fact that he has more homers than 2Bs and 3Bs combined points to luck that he gets good wood on anything. And 13 walks to 30 Ks is gross, although he’s no Carlos Gomez.
by BigTexBD on May 15, 2008 12:16 AM CDT 0 recs
Send Him Down
Nothing Bourn has done, including his three home runs, has changed my mind on him: I just don’t think he’s a major league hitter.
The attittude that the club has taken--that they see no reason to change while the club is doing well—seems short-sighted in the extreme, like sticking your head in the sand, pretending that no problem exists.
It’s like the captain of the Titanic saying we can take action once we hit the iceberg.
The club has surprised lots of people with its pitching, and the hitting has even been better than expected. The Brewers are a disaster in their bullpen and a disappointment in the infield, the Cubs are gonna start giving starts to Jim Edmonds if you can believe that, and the Astros might just have a chance to win the division. But you’re going to need to create every possible advantage for yourself.
It will be a self-fulfilling prophecy: if you wait to start losing before you make a move, you WILL start losing.
You cannot leadoff with a .190 hitter and expect to continue winning.
Footer was saying they won’t move Pence to center, but I say why not? Or if you won’t do that, get Erstad in there. He’s been a pleasant surprise.
But get rid of Bourn, before you blow the possibility of a wonderful surprise season!
Let's talk about something other than Tejada
by rastronomicals on May 15, 2008 8:22 AM CDT 0 recs
One wonders if the high price paid for Bourn (Lidge), and the fact that Lidge is now...
“lights out” again, has anything to do with the Astros exhibiting infinite patience with Bourn. I’m not saying I believe that…but I notice that rotoworld suggested something to that effect.
I voted for moving Bourn down in the lineup. I have been in favor of that for a long time. I would give him another month or so of at bats; he does appear to be hitting into bad luck sometimes, though his K rate is atrocious. If excessive pressure is hurting Bourn, moving him out of the lead off spot may help. What really hurts is that Bourn isn’t the only player in the lineup with hitting issues…the catcher and 3d base position both are sub-par. If the Astros had better offense from the other two positions, keeping Bourn in the lineup as a “defense first” player, like Adam Everett of the past, might be OK. The Astros also made a mistake in failing to pick up a reserve outfielder who can bat well from the right side. I realize Cruz, Jr. was supposed to play that role, but he was never a good bet to hit well at this stage of his career. Erstad’s recent history suggests that he is good, so long as he is used against righthanders. But Erstad can’t be platooned with the LH Bourn, and he likely will falter on a full time basis if he isn’t platooned.
by clack on
May 15, 2008 8:38 AM CDT
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i agree
that the right move at this time is probably just to move him to the back of the lineup. i think sending him down would be foolish. they wouldn’t have thrust him into this situation if they didn’t think he was a major league player and they wouldn’t give up on him after a month and half, and i don’t think they should. his defense has been superb, much better than we’ll get from anybody else in our system, except maybe Yordany Ramirez, who’s not exactly lighting it up in Round Rock (OBP of .192). Taveras struggled in the leadoff spot, moved down, and was able to gain some confidence with a little less pressure.
i guess the most likely replacement in the leadoff spot would be Pence, but taking him out of the 6th spot would weaken the middle of our lineup a bit. it’d be nice if Wiggy was being his normal self and could fill the role of a power bat behind Lee better. Bourn in the 8-hole might not be so bad. he won’t see as many pitches to hit, being in front of the pitcher, but if he can get on and get over with the pitcher behind him, maybe he can be in a position to use his speed with Pence following when the lineup flips over.
anyway, i think sending Bourn to the minors would be a mistake, but then again, i still think there’s hope that he can turn it around and at least be an average hitter, which with his speed and defense would make him still quite valuable to the club.
by littlevisigoth on
May 15, 2008 8:57 AM CDT
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me as well
I voted to move him down and move Pence up…
I can’t be too down on Wigginton, he really hasn’t gotten a steady chance to play on a regular basis due to his injury problems… He only has 53 at bats(3 more than Brad Ausmus). I think once he gets past his injuries and gets to play 15-20 games in a row, he will straighten out and go back to what he was last season.
Go 'Stros!
by Stros Bro on
May 15, 2008 9:04 AM CDT
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Would you want Kenny Lofton?
I’m not sure if he’s willing to play anymore, but he’s not on a team and will at least provide a decent bat in the lineup. He doesn’t solve the problem of needing right handed hitter in the outfield, but he could maybe play some if you don’t think Erstad is durable enough for a full season.
I think the need for a right handed hitter is needed more than just the need to take some pressure off someone to replace Bourn if he falters.
We don’t have much in AAA to help, Abecrombie is the best outfielder offense wise, but he’s only batting .261 in Round Rock. In double A you got a few guys batting in the .280’s, but then again… that’s a big leap for someone to take any real playing time in the bigs…
Go 'Stros!
by Stros Bro on
May 15, 2008 9:02 AM CDT
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only if you want to give up on Bourn
signing Kenny Lofton is a win-now move (which is certainly no slam-dunk). based on last year, you’d have to believe he can still play at an above average level (but his defense isn’t what it once was… he wasn’t playing CF for Cleveland last year). if they believe in Bourn and want him to be their CF of the future, signing Lofton and relegating Bourn to the minors could put that in jeopardy. what I see the Astros really wanting is for Bourn to adapt and become what they thought he would. i don’t think dropping him in the order would prevent that from happening.
i wonder what Lofton would sign for, not that i want the Astros to sign him, i just wonder.
by littlevisigoth on
May 15, 2008 11:40 AM CDT
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I dunno
I think he played for 6 million last season, and hit almost .300(too lazy to look it up)...
I don’t think Lofton is the way to go… but it could be an option.
Go 'Stros!
by Stros Bro on
May 15, 2008 11:42 AM CDT
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correct
he made $6MM last year, $3.85MM in ‘06, and $3.1MM in ‘05 and ‘04.
he hit a combined .296 between Texas and Cleveland last year, with an OPS somehwere between .750-.800 (don’t want to do the math to calculate the combined stats), and was an impact player in the Tribe’s playoff run. i can’t imagine he’s not going to sign on with a contender sometime down the stretch (assuming he’s staying in shape and will be ready to play). i’m just not sure he’s right for the Astros.
by littlevisigoth on
May 15, 2008 11:57 AM CDT
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Isn't Kenny Lofton one of those players...
that always finds himself in the playoffs year after year despite changing teams a lot? Maybe we SHOULD sign him. :p
(That may be someone else I’m thinking of though.)
by entropic soul on
May 15, 2008 8:49 PM CDT
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Bat him 8th for a week or so.
Takes the pressure off. Pence to No. 2, which keeps the BLT/Pickle gang of four together, just puts the Pickle at the front.
Matsui doesn’t care much for batting leadoff, I understand, but for the team’s sake, he should do it for a week or so. If Bourn can’t get straightened out after 7-10 games in the 8 spot, then it’s time to start Erstad most of the time. I’m all for being patient with Bourn, and the Astros have been, but there’s gotta be a limit. I’d say 1/3 of the season is about right.
There is a bright side to the '08 season.
Barry Bonds & Roger Clemens are out of baseball.
by maris61 on May 15, 2008 10:44 AM CDT 0 recs
for the weekend series
in Arlington, wouldn’t you think this would be a perfect chance to bat Bourn 9th? that’d be at least 3 days out of the leadoff spot to try to get a little confidence going.
by littlevisigoth on
May 15, 2008 11:42 AM CDT
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definitely
And they could say they are moving him there to have a fast guy to get on base in front of matsuis/pence/tejada/berkman
Go 'Stros!
by Stros Bro on
May 15, 2008 11:43 AM CDT
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After a bad game today for Bourn
And Erstad going yard, I think I’m leaning towards wanting to change my vote :)
Go 'Stros!
by Stros Bro on May 15, 2008 6:31 PM CDT 0 recs
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NL Central Standings
| W | L | PCT | GB | STRK | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
Chicago
|
97 | 64 | .602 | 0 | Lost 4 |
|
Milwaukee
|
90 | 72 | .555 | 7.5 | Lost 1 |
|
Houston
|
86 | 75 | .534 | 11 | Won 1 |
|
St. Louis
|
86 | 76 | .530 | 11.5 | Won 6 |
|
Cincinnati
|
74 | 88 | .456 | 23.5 | Lost 5 |
|
Pittsburgh
|
67 | 95 | .413 | 30.5 | Won 1 |
(updated 10.7.2008 at 12:00 AM CDT)
